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Author Topic: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS  (Read 23734 times)

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September 01, 2012, 10:02:20 AM
Reply #15

X5Sport

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2012, 10:02:20 AM »
It didn't make any sense to me either, and when I was in the Dealership yesterday I queried this bit with the Service Manager.  He said that BMW have still not issued a fix, nor even acknowledged the issue (I did ask him if he was aware that the Police and motoring organisations were jumping up and down about it?  I also told him that everyone else in his and the Sales Teams knew about it, and even BMW GB had said they were working on a fix!  To his credit he looked sheepish and dropped that bit!).

Apparently it affects all versions of the BMW models made after 2004 when the first cars with this type key first appeared - on one of the 5-series - but wasn't an issue until the key programmers became readily available.

In the meantime, the Dealership has begun moving and hiding the OBDII ports to make it harder to carry out this type of cloning theft.  It is being done 'at Customer Request' - aka you get billed!!

Richard
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September 02, 2012, 11:01:29 PM
Reply #16

V12 EGO

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2012, 11:01:29 PM »
My dealer said it affected all BMWs with the key that pushes into a slot, I.e Exx series it does'nt apparently affect any of the Fxx range
Regards,

James
2011 F10 520d ED
2007 E70 X5 3.0d SE (SOLD)
2007 E91 Alpina D3 (SOLD)
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September 04, 2012, 03:44:43 AM
Reply #17

535dboy

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #17 on: September 04, 2012, 03:44:43 AM »
My dealer said it affected all BMWs with the key that pushes into a slot, I.e Exx series it does'nt apparently affect any of the Fxx range

Interesting username - I know of a lady that has that plate on her AM DB9 Volante in the next village to me
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September 04, 2012, 06:08:18 PM
Reply #18

V12 EGO

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #18 on: September 04, 2012, 06:08:18 PM »
My dealer said it affected all BMWs with the key that pushes into a slot, I.e Exx series it does'nt apparently affect any of the Fxx range

Interesting username - I know of a lady that has that plate on her AM DB9 Volante in the next village to me

I don't consider that I have much of an ego to massage (especially as my own car is a 520d  :)) ) but it was a username I started off using on the 7 Series forum when I had a 750iL. It dropped to V8 EGO when I bought an Alpina B10 V8. Hopefully I don't come across as an egotist, just a legacy thing. Better than a freind of mine who uses bargain bucket as his handle because he can eat a whole bargain bucket on his own (shudder!!).
Regards,

James
2011 F10 520d ED
2007 E70 X5 3.0d SE (SOLD)
2007 E91 Alpina D3 (SOLD)
2005 E65 750i Sport (SOLD)
2005 E65 730d Sport (SOLD)
2001 E39 Alpina B10 V8 Touring (SOLD)
2001 E39 Alpina B10 V8 (SOLD)
1999 E38 750iL (SOLD)
1997 E38 750iL (SOLD)

September 04, 2012, 07:19:55 PM
Reply #19

X5Sport

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #19 on: September 04, 2012, 07:19:55 PM »
My dealer said it affected all BMWs with the key that pushes into a slot, I.e Exx series it does'nt apparently affect any of the Fxx range
The missing word is 'yet'.   >:(
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September 06, 2012, 07:22:55 PM
Reply #20

Steamyrotter

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #20 on: September 06, 2012, 07:22:55 PM »
I always say -

Man made it, Man can break it....


(not being sexist or PC!)
If things were meant to be easy, then I will soon complicate them....
Please note...
Anything I say is only from my personal experience and knowledge..
I don't assume to know everything, and know there is a lot I don't know..
But then I could be talking bollox.. O:-)

September 07, 2012, 11:55:25 AM
Reply #21

X5Sport

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #21 on: September 07, 2012, 11:55:25 AM »
Software Updates now being carried out to the 'Comfort Pack'.  Mine in next week.  No further details offered by Dealer.
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September 12, 2012, 11:13:11 AM
Reply #22

davyk31

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2012, 11:13:11 AM »
Is there a fix for E70 X5 models, the BBC website talks of a fix for pre 2011 X5. Mine is 2008 so I want it sorted if available.

Also in post above it refers to "comfort pack", is this just cars with Comfort Access, again I have that.

September 12, 2012, 12:14:59 PM
Reply #23

Sanj

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2012, 12:14:59 PM »
On the front page of the BBC News website now...

And Watchdog tonight.
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September 12, 2012, 12:30:17 PM
Reply #24

X5Sport

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2012, 12:30:17 PM »
BBC Link

Just been talking to Service at the Dealership (mine in tomorrow) and the current recall affects quote "X5, X6 pre-Sept 2011 build" end quote.  ALL car keys are also required when the car goes in and it will take all day.

****************************

Copy of BMW Statement for those who have trouble with links......via Tapatalk etc

Responding to the investigation BMW said: "Certain criminal threats, like the one you have highlighted, simply do not exist when cars are designed and developed.

"This does not mean the car companies have done anything wrong, neither are they legally obliged to take any action.

"However, BMW has always taken security extremely seriously and has worked closely with police forces around the country (and the world), and with the industry body, the SMMT (The Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders) to understand and mitigate against car crime wherever possible.

"Therefore, when we were made aware of this new form of attack, we took it very seriously and immediately launched an investigation."

"There is no specific BMW security issue here. We, like our customers and those of other manufacturers, are victims of this new high-tech organised crime.

"All our cars meet all security standards and regulations, but as responsible manufacturers we are looking at ways of mitigating against this new kind of attack.

"We are already in the process of enhancing the protection of pre-September 2011 X5 and X6 models and have been contacting owners and carrying out the necessary work accordingly.


**********************

From the remarks made, this does indeed sound like an update to try to secure the loophole in the cars which allows for easy theft, but I cannot get anyone to actually agree that is really what it is about - they get evasive when pushed for an accurate answer!

If you have a pre-Sept 2011 built (NOT registered!!) E70/E71 and haven't heard from your Dealer then I can only suggest you start leaning on them.  I only knew because of the threads on here, and had to go via my sales contact to find out what was going on.

Richard
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September 12, 2012, 08:00:40 PM
Reply #25

graemeX5

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2012, 08:00:40 PM »
Just heard on telly about the BMW theft problem is going to,be a topic on watchdog shortly and they want people to email in, it's on now!
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September 12, 2012, 08:14:26 PM
Reply #26

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #26 on: September 12, 2012, 08:14:26 PM »
Initially work being done on the X5 & X6 but 'now being offered to owners of other models free of charge'......hmmm
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September 13, 2012, 01:24:18 PM
Reply #27

satts

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2012, 01:24:18 PM »
I just e-mailed my local dealer this morning and got this reply:

I hope you are well? Don't worry!
 
This new type of electronic theft simply didn't exist when these vehicles were designed and developed. All BMW vehicles are built to meet global legislative requirements.
However, BMW has always taken security extremely seriously and has worked closely with police forces around the country (and the world), with Thatcham and with the industry body, the SMMT (The Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders) to understand and mitigate against car crime wherever possible.

BMW X5 and X6 models that were produced prior to September 2011 have been particularly targeted by thieves .

Whilst there is no manufacturing defect with X5 and X6 models, BMW has taken action to provide steps to mitigate against this type of theft.

Your vehicle was built on 13.01.2012 and so already has these measures in place.

I hope this reassures you

So, it appears newer models have the "mod" already carried out, however, how does the scumbag thief know this when you have a personalised "54" plate on!  >:(

I hope BMW resolves this problem for all very quickly, because it will be them who lose in the long term, how many of this forum are saying "I'm not buying another BMW" I suspect a few!

Regards to all

Satts

September 13, 2012, 01:30:07 PM
Reply #28

535dboy

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2012, 01:30:07 PM »
Problem doesn't just affect BMWs though from what I understood

An article in autocar showed a pound of cars which include rangies, audis and mercs

The problem stems from the EU who said manufacturers had to open up ECUs and allow non factory machines to be able to access their cars systems under competition rules.

I'm not changing my car from BMW for this reason, I just don't like them anymore.

This problem could probably affect my new ones too.

It is what it is I'm afraid.

Unfortunately there are too many wankers out there that want what we have all worked hard for and don't care how they get it. That is as much a problem with the way these people are dealt with more than because BMW have found a glitch in the system
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September 13, 2012, 02:07:27 PM
Reply #29

X5Sport

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Re: MODS PLEASE STICKY : WARNING - BMW THEFTS - WITH FOB KEYS
« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2012, 02:07:27 PM »
Exactly.  It doesn't matter how good the defences might, or might not, have been at the design point, there will always be people trying to get around it - exactly as happens in the IT Industry every day.  With more and more of the car systems - from EVERY manufacturer - become more IT based, so the hackers skills become more useful in that market.

Car manufacturers will always only ever do the MINIMUM necessary to get their cars approved, period.  EVERYTHING else remains in the hands of the owners to resolve.  Cars are now a hell of a lot harder to steal than they were 20 years ago but it is an 'arms race' and all the time there is a market in places like Eastern Europe, parts of the Middle East and especially West & South Africa for these cars then the thefts will go on unabated.  In South East Asia the import duty on a brand new BMW can be over 100%!!  Second hand, no such duty.

As Owners all we can do is trust the car manufacturers to look at the obvious risks and deal with them.  In this case (and with my former Risk Manager's hat on) BMW totally missed - or decided to ignore because the Cost/Benefit Analysis pointed them that way - a number of obvious holes that should have been identified at the design stage and therefore mitigated.  As an example - if it was identified that the alarm system had a blind spot then they should never put anything in that area that could lead to access to the car's primary control systems.  Likewise, if you're going to leave the OBDII port permanently live and enabled then put it out of reach and covered by the car's defences, and put a security lock on it.

Let's face it, the Nav systems require a complex single use keycode to put a new update into place.  That code is built from the car's VIN and some other criteria - but it has been cracked and is available for a fraction of the BMW OEM cost.  The ODBII port has NO defence on it.

At present we don't know what the 'fix' is, but you can bet that somewhere someone will be working out how to get around it.  The EU decision made things far too easy in this case, but the manufacturer could and should have thought things through more carefully.

What has annoyed BMW is they got caught with their pants down in public - and that has severely embarrassed them.  It seems their management teams have forgotten about this thing called the 'Internet' and that new travels very fast and very widely - be it for legit owners like us, or the criminal underworld trying to steal what we've worked hard to buy.

The lessons won't be learned though - simply because from the manufacturers point of view they don't have to be.  If their sales market collapses then and only then will the peole at the top pay attention, fire a couple of people, take their obscene bonuses and hope it all goes away......until next time!!

I have no faith in the 'system' and so have taken additional precautions - as many of us will have - but in the end if the thieves want the car, they'll find a way be it violent, peaceful, brute force, or technical.

Richard
:type: